ben i saw a video a few years back from south america they were using baking soda... they mixed it with the black sands and heated it and the gold stayed with the baking soda.. i'll see if i can find that video. it was a very simple process .

here is one using borax...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6Sawj0HyF0&list=PL9CU79S7QDIS95HNU_-bfwtu0MnY_qj37

I have had some of the cons. I got off the beach in Nome many years ago and have tried several times to separate the gold, which is relatively plentiful in the mix. I bought the Black Magic fine gold separator but was not successful in getting the fines to separate from the heavies.

I talked with a gentleman at the Gold & Treasure Show in Knoxville this past June who had a vile of this flour gold from Nome and it was very clean. He said the process he used was "back panning". I am not familiar with this technique. Would appreciate it if anyone could point me to an explanation or video relating to this process.

I posted this up thread a ways. Take the 45 minutes and watch it all. Its the Gold Cube man. It will tell you how to get that gold... Though you
may have to go further than he is going.

http://www.treasurenet.co...rt-gold-panning.html

I'm going to tell you a little story. I'm a newb also, maybe just a tiny tic off newb status, but not very far. So this is from a newb learning something new.

Where I dig, they said it was "fine" gold... I was going down 20-40-60.... After going through the cube. I too bought a black magic fine gold sluice. It just
sits there now... Anyways. Average 30 pieces of gold in a 4 bucket sample...

For some reason I went out and bought some 80 and 120 screens. My last 4 samples (2-4 buckets each), from the same area, I ran the cons from the cube through
an 80 and a 120 screen, piece of gold count went up from 30ish to close to 200 per sample. Full blown golden smiley in the -120... problem being a lot of that stuff was
even smaller and I had a hard time seperating it.

Mike Pung, the Gold Cube man, the guy in the videos I linked above... "The Golden Rule, if everything in your pan is the same size, GOLD RULES".

Classify, Classify, Classify. Then pan... To make the Black Magic work to its potential, you have to classify classify classify, a blue bowl, classify classify classify,
spiral wheel, classify classify classify. And once its classified, its super quick and easy to pan. Rub your head pat your belly. Rock and tap.

I've now got a 250 and a 400 screen. When you get that small "mesh" size kind of falls apart since the wires take up a huge amount of the space.
A 4 is 4 holes per inch, a quarter inch, even if the wires are 30 thou, you are still about a quarter of an inch. 25 mesh. 25 holes per inch. 40 thou, a
small bit of variation, if the wires are 5 or 10 thou, you aren't that far off of 40 thou... Get down to really small. 400, like I bought for instance.
Is the wire .001 or .0015? Makes a big difference at that size. 400 mesh with .001 wire is a .0015 hole. with a .002 wire is a .0005 hole. thats a 3x
difference in hole size, just because of the wire size, and its considered the same mesh size.

Anyways, I bought the screens from McMaster Carr, they actually list wire size and hole size. my 80 is .008ish, my 120 is a tick over .004 (average thickness
of a human hair), the 250 is .0025 and the 400 is .0015. I haven't tried those yet...

Moral of the story.. If everything in the pan is the same size GOLD RULES. If you can't get it separate from the black sands, you need to classify, then it will pop
right apart. If you want your black magic to work, you need to classify. There really is no cheating short of melting it down, YOU NEED TO CLASSIFY.

Simple fact, a larger rock will move a small piece of gold. A rock the same size or even double the size of a piece of gold will not. Gold panning is a density and weight game.
Gold is dense, 19 times heavier than water. Black sands are pretty hefty also, about 6 times heavier than water. Your regular dirt, about 3 times.

The weird thing is, once you classify, it is so simple to pan it. It all pops apart real quick. Rock rock rock, tap tap tap, rock rock, tap tap etc... and you'll have mostly clean gold.
If you are seeing gold walk away with the black sands, or if you even see gold smaller than the junk material in the pan, you need to classify again to a smaller size.

in most cases when I get fine or flour gold I save what's in pan concentrates in a plastic jar to run later in a blue bowl or you can use some of the other newer machines like spiral wheel to help collect it, then dry it afterwards. there are many ways to collect it talk with others to see their methods and find out which ones work best for you.it also depends on what you can afford to buy or make there are several methods, never though concentrates away you can rerun them over and over till there is no more gold in it.

 

I have read that a Miller Table is only good for larger than 40 micron size. Comments?

What about the Blue Bowl?

At what size of gold particles does it become necesary to leach it out?



As mentioned earlier, I bought a Gold Cube.

It did trap very small amount flour gold. Don't know how much I missed.



Crushed some rocks from same local.

There was a small amount of gold.

Required microscope at 800x to see it.

Dont know the size of what was there. 

  

Does anyone have any first hand knowledge with this operation?

http://www.preciousmetals.../solventexchange.cfm

I am a little confused with some of this "fine" gold.....are most of you sure that it is actually gold and not mica. I always seem to find what I think is gold and it very fine but  see that it actually turns out to be flaky pieces of mica.

Posted By LEO LORENZ on 12 Aug 2015 10:15 AM

I am a little confused with some of this "fine" gold.....are most of you sure that it is actually gold and not mica. I always seem to find what I think is gold and it very fine but  see that it actually turns out to be flaky pieces of mica.

The area I am in is known for micron size gold that needs to be leeched from crushed rock/ore.

There is a mine leeching operation about a mile from this claim.

 

Hey everyone...

Been a while since I have been back to the GPAA Forum. Sorry.

Yeah, I tried writing a BIG, detailed reply about a year ago, and when I tried to submit it, it wouldn't post. Sorry. I have to say a LOT of what I covered & recommended is found in this video tutorial by Mike Pung of Gold Cube fame: http://www.treasurenet.co...rt-gold-panning.html

As to cleanup equipment for your cons to rapidly get "super cons" for hand panning...........I've found nothing better than Mike & Red's Gold Cube. I've had bowls, wheels & min-sluices. Ugh. All slow, slow, slow. All very finicky as to water speeds, angles, feed rates of your cons, adjustments... Ugh. The Cube is a no-brainer. Set it up, prep the trays, level it up and start runnin' your material/cons. I've done test after test and normally get 95% in my top tray and maybe 5% (if that) in my second tray. I have no need for a 3rd try. My worked cons never show any gold lost in them. I have the 3-stack deluxe with slick plate & 2 Vortex matting trays. I can run a LOT of heavy black sand cons in minutes. Super simple. Again, a no-brainer. I use mine both as a concentrator in my garage and a production highbanker with Gold Banker unit on top on the river.

I agree that classifying your cons for hand panning is essential. However, personally, I don't go crazy with all the sizes. I simply screen my cons with a 1/8th inch mesh and a 20 mesh. This gives me 3 separate sizes. However, because I'll have a range of gold in each of my 3 sizes I highly recommend you pan LESS material at a time. Less is more, believe me when you're wanting ALL your gold as you get better settling action, easier washing and you'll be able to see any fine gold trying to migrate out of your pan on the side wall. I re-pan my finest size a second time. I always save my "old" cons in a bucket in my garage to run thru the Cube again, at a later date. Always get a little more back.....always.

I personally use plastic pans only and use a really coarse piece of say 30-grit or 40-grit sandpaper to scratch in a nice cross-hatch pattern on the sides........NOT the bottom. I prefer the Garrett's gravity trap 10 inch finishing pan, not for the traps.....never use the things. Traps are a crutch to better panning technique. I love it because it has a very small bottom and VERY long sides. It's the sides that allow you to spread the cons out thin, let the gold grab a scratch and lets the black sand to slowly wash away.

Having scratches on the sides of you pan lets the black sand wash out easily still and yet even the tiniest speck of gold or little flat flake will "grab a scratch" and gravity will tend to hold it there, so you don't lose it. I let the gold get 1/2 way out of the pan, then resettle it all, repeat. When I get down to the very last bit of black sand & fine gold, I use the "backwash & tap" method, like many do. Here's a video I did way back in 2008. This was with unclassified cons below about 3/8th of an inch, so I used about 1/4 cup at a time, but when I am doing just black sand cons I normally do only 1 teaspoon at a time. Remember, panning less at one time is more: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Cbiiohp5bQ

Here's some panning recommendations I normally offer to new and intermediate panners: http://c17a.forumotion.co...ning-recommendations

Here in High Colorado I sluice, Gold Cube & suction dredge for almost nothing BUT fine flour/flood gold. Almost nothing over 20 mesh and 75 to 80% will all be -50 mesh to 200 nano specks......and all in VERY heavy black Magnetite & Hematite iron sands. For me the Cube is the real deal and panning less is more and backwash & tap works every time!

HTH,

Randy Witham "C-17A" www.goldadventures.biz Buena Vista, Colorado

I am not at all impressed with the gold cube I have.

the top green mat is not laid out correctly it seems.
There is a hollow where everything winds up at.
Can't get an even flow, well can, but that hollow area just really collects everything and does not flow on out like it should.

Thinking about searching for another claim, or else sell everything I have and be done with it.

Ben,

Have you ever tried something that would circulate the water in a whirlpool motion within a circular container? I am thinking that just the mere physical properties of the fine flour gold, still having a density of 19 just as the larger gold, would allow it to settle in a mass together, separate from the less dense material. Then just drain off the water from the container to say a 1/2 of 3/4 of an inch, and then just leave it set until the remaining water evaporates leaving the gold powder. I am kind of thinking something much like a centrifuge, but not with such a high rpm. Maybe an rpm that would meet the resonant frequency of the gold. I think there are other ways to do what you are trying to accomplish, maybe by using other non traditional methods. 

Joe from the dirt you have run already....have you found anything at all? What state are you searching in?

Hi Joseph, 

You should post some pics of your gold cube.  I've never in my life seen a gold cube with green matting.  That's weird. They don't have green matting. Look at them on goldcube.net, or anywhere else.   Did you buy it used?  Maybe someone modified it and did a poor job.  There is no reason for any mods with the gold cube.   Same thing with the hollow area you are talking about.  I don't know what your talking about.  Please post some pics of it and maybe someone could help, otherwise no gold cube user has any idea what you are talking about.  What size pump are you using, and what size material are you feeding it.  There is very specific instructions about what size material you should run thru it. Did you read the instructions, or watch any of Mike Pung's videos on how to use it?  Maybe you're trying to run unclassified material thru it.  It sounds like you're not really into prospecting that much anyway if you are considering selling your equipment, if it's not because you need the money.  I've seen Randy Witham's gold cube in action, and it works.  He left you a comment.  I ran old cons that I had panned last year thru his gold cube, and it is freakin' fast and extremely efficient.  I bought a gold cube after that, and it has black vortex matting on each tray. It is an industry standard with a proven track record.  Many commercial ops use the gold cube as a super concentrator before the final cleanup.  I have no idea what you are talking about.  Can you be a little more specific?

Matt

Miller Table